Discussion:
Did the earth move for you too?
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cryptoengineer
2011-08-23 18:44:03 UTC
Permalink
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.

I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.

Pt
Alan Woodford
2011-08-23 18:58:08 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 14:44:03 -0400, cryptoengineer
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
It's a bit far away to move me :-)

But I hope Keith and everyone else in the area are OK!

Alan Woodford
The Greying Lensman!
cryptoengineer
2011-08-23 19:03:56 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 19:58:08 +0100, Alan Woodford
Post by Alan Woodford
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 14:44:03 -0400, cryptoengineer
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while
around
Post by Alan Woodford
Post by cryptoengineer
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
It's a bit far away to move me :-)
But I hope Keith and everyone else in the area are OK!
My main concern are his bookshelves. I expect he was at work.

Pt
David Dyer-Bennet
2011-08-23 19:11:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Nothing out here, of course. Best wishes to everybody
in range to be affected! So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I hope that's true, and remains true.
Tim McDaniel
2011-08-23 20:07:26 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I saw a report of damage to china.
--
Tim McDaniel; Reply-To: ***@panix.com
Dorothy J Heydt
2011-08-23 20:25:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tim McDaniel
In article
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I saw a report of damage to china.
In unsecured cupboards or open shelves? You bet. Any report yet
of fallen chimneys?
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.
cryptoengineer
2011-08-23 21:01:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Tim McDaniel
In article
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I saw a report of damage to china.
In unsecured cupboards or open shelves? You bet. Any report yet
of fallen chimneys?
I've read reports of fallen stonework at the National Cathedral.

Pt
David Harmon
2011-08-24 05:06:27 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 17:01:13 -0400 in rec.arts.sf.fandom,
Post by cryptoengineer
I've read reports of fallen stonework at the National Cathedral.
Washington Monument closed due to earthquake damage.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/08/23/washington-monument-indefinitely-closes-after-earthquake-causes-crack/
Philip Chee
2011-08-24 02:27:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tim McDaniel
In article
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I saw a report of damage to china.
Are you sure? That's on the other side of the world!

Phil
--
Philip Chee <***@aleytys.pc.my>, <***@gmail.com>
http://flashblock.mozdev.org/ http://xsidebar.mozdev.org
Guard us from the she-wolf and the wolf, and guard us from the thief,
oh Night, and so be good for us to pass.
Jay E. Morris
2011-08-24 02:44:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Philip Chee
Post by Tim McDaniel
In article
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I saw a report of damage to china.
Are you sure? That's on the other side of the world!
Phil
No, it's on the floor.
Dorothy J Heydt
2011-08-24 03:09:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Philip Chee
Post by Tim McDaniel
In article
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I saw a report of damage to china.
Are you sure? That's on the other side of the world!
/wince
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.
Dorothy J Heydt
2011-08-23 19:48:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Dyer-Bennet
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Nothing out here, of course. Best wishes to everybody
in range to be affected! So far the news reports are
saying "no reports of serious damage or casualties";
I hope that's true, and remains true.
Sea Wasp posted about it on rasf-written. Here's the USGS page
on it if anyone's interested:

http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsww/Quakes/se082311a.html

And an update:

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/202683/20110823/virginia-earthquake-5-8-richmond-washington-dc-new-york-city-nyc-toronto-charlottesville-louisa-coun.org
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.
Keith F. Lynch
2011-08-24 01:59:23 UTC
Permalink
None of my books fell. Some of my magazine boxes full of loose papers
did, as did a shelf in the bedroom that held loose papers. The latter
knocked a flat-screen monitor off a cabinet onto the floor. I haven't
tested it to see if it still works, but I never use it anyway. The
power did not go off at my apartment or anywhere else that I know of.

My mother is okay. She was at home, recently returned from a nursing
home for the first time since she fell and broke her hip two months
ago. She was being visited by a phsical therapist who was having her
walk. Fortunately, she was sitting down when the earthquake happened,
or she likely would have fallen and broken her other hip.
--
Keith F. Lynch - http://keithlynch.net/
Please see http://keithlynch.net/email.html before emailing me.
Harry Mary Andruschak
2011-08-24 05:04:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Only a wimpy 5.9? REAL Californians sleep on through 5.9s.
Martha Adams
2011-08-24 12:18:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Harry Mary Andruschak
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Only a wimpy 5.9? REAL Californians sleep on through 5.9s.
===================================================================

Hah! I like that. However. The news mentions unusual-event responses
from twelve nuke power plants, and that one or two of those temporarily
shut down. As I think about this, it seems a little alarming to me (no
pun intended). Because, looking at events in Japan and back in time, I
see that nuclear power plants necessarily have one or more
*tremendously poisonous* nuclear reactors in them, so that while safety
systems make severe radiation releasing accidents unlikely, yet these
happen and then there is a terrible price to pay.

Such that, now I'm questioning if we can afford to have those nuclear
reactors here in our human world. Yes, our systems today need that
power urgently; and the price per kwh is majorly important. But look at
what happens if *just one* of those big nukes fails into breakdown and
breach.

I've read of nuclear reactors designed to fail safe under worst possible
conditions. One of those is a pebble bed reactor which uses hot gas to
carry out the heat. Under worst failure conditions at full power, the
bottom opens and the pebbles fall down into several bins, far from
criticality; and the physical plant can tolerate the heat. (A power
nuke shut-down quickly, initially produces heat at several percent of
full-power level.)

But I'm seeing nothing in the news about fail-safe reactors, nor of any
plans to build any anywhere. Nothing! I think this is a bad sign for
the future.

Titeotwawki -- Martha Adams [Wed 2011 Aug 24]
Bernard Peek
2011-08-24 13:44:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Martha Adams
Hah! I like that. However. The news mentions unusual-event responses
from twelve nuke power plants, and that one or two of those temporarily
shut down. As I think about this, it seems a little alarming to me (no
pun intended). Because, looking at events in Japan and back in time, I
see that nuclear power plants necessarily have one or more *tremendously
poisonous* nuclear reactors in them, so that while safety systems make
severe radiation releasing accidents unlikely, yet these happen and then
there is a terrible price to pay.
There has only ever been one catastrophic failure and the worst effect
of that was to make a great deal of not very good farmland unusable.
Post by Martha Adams
Such that, now I'm questioning if we can afford to have those nuclear
reactors here in our human world. Yes, our systems today need that
power urgently; and the price per kwh is majorly important. But look at
what happens if *just one* of those big nukes fails into breakdown and
breach.
That happened in Japan and the worst effect was to shut down the local
fishing industry.
Post by Martha Adams
I've read of nuclear reactors designed to fail safe under worst possible
conditions. One of those is a pebble bed reactor which uses hot gas to
carry out the heat. Under worst failure conditions at full power, the
bottom opens and the pebbles fall down into several bins, far from
criticality; and the physical plant can tolerate the heat. (A power
nuke shut-down quickly, initially produces heat at several percent of
full-power level.)
But I'm seeing nothing in the news about fail-safe reactors, nor of any
plans to build any anywhere. Nothing! I think this is a bad sign for
the future.
That's because the switch to fail-safe reactors happened a long time ago
and it's no longer news. The Japanese reactors were some of the last to
be built without that feature.
--
Bernard Peek
***@shrdlu.com
r***@rosettacondot.com
2011-08-24 14:32:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Martha Adams
Post by Harry Mary Andruschak
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Only a wimpy 5.9? REAL Californians sleep on through 5.9s.
===================================================================
Hah! I like that. However. The news mentions unusual-event responses
from twelve nuke power plants, and that one or two of those temporarily
shut down. As I think about this, it seems a little alarming to me (no
pun intended). Because, looking at events in Japan and back in time, I
see that nuclear power plants necessarily have one or more
*tremendously poisonous* nuclear reactors in them, so that while safety
systems make severe radiation releasing accidents unlikely, yet these
happen and then there is a terrible price to pay.
Without disagreeing that the contents of the reactors are poisonous, I
think that "notification of unusual event" doesn't mean what you think
it means, but rather exactly what it says...an unusual event has
happened that has a potential, however remote, to impact safety. An
earthquake of significant magntitude is automatically such an event. So
are tsunamis, uncontrolled fires in the area, etc. For example, Diablo
Canyon declared a NOUE after the Japan earthquake and tsunami despite
estimates that the effect on the California coast would be minor.
Post by Martha Adams
Such that, now I'm questioning if we can afford to have those nuclear
reactors here in our human world. Yes, our systems today need that
power urgently; and the price per kwh is majorly important. But look at
what happens if *just one* of those big nukes fails into breakdown and
breach.
Reactors have the potential to cause significant loss of life, but other
generation technologies do so on an ongoing basis. I believe the excess
deaths solely due to lung disease from coal plant emissions are estimated
at 24,000 per year, and those are certainly not the only ones.
Post by Martha Adams
I've read of nuclear reactors designed to fail safe under worst possible
conditions. One of those is a pebble bed reactor which uses hot gas to
carry out the heat. Under worst failure conditions at full power, the
bottom opens and the pebbles fall down into several bins, far from
criticality; and the physical plant can tolerate the heat. (A power
nuke shut-down quickly, initially produces heat at several percent of
full-power level.)
But I'm seeing nothing in the news about fail-safe reactors, nor of any
plans to build any anywhere. Nothing! I think this is a bad sign for
the future.
Lots of research on pebble bed (PBR) and other "fail safe" reactor designs.
It's just not "newsworthy" in the conventional since. They all have
significant engineering and political issues to overcome. Engineering because
the technology is still immature and either small scale or entirely
theoretical, political because the regulatory environment is designed for
pressurized water reactors (PWR).
As one example, PBRs produce a very large amount of low-level radioactive
waste as opposed to PWRs which produce a much smaller amount of high-level
waste. Because the long-term storage requirements are similar the
disposal cost is much higher for the PBRs.
Also, anti-nuclear activists tend not to look further than the word "reactor"
before starting their protests.
China, with its...how to put this politely...somewhat lower sensitivity
to impact on the environment, public health and public opinion looks like a
good candidate to put the technology into production.

Robert
--
Robert K. Shull Email: rkshull at rosettacon dot com
Evelyn Leeper
2011-08-24 13:42:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Harry Mary Andruschak
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Only a wimpy 5.9? REAL Californians sleep on through 5.9s.
Except, of course, that buildings in California are built to cope with
earthquakes, while most buildings in DC probably are not.
--
Evelyn C. Leeper
Even God cannot change the past. -Aristotle, "Nicomachean Ethics"
Dorothy J Heydt
2011-08-24 14:59:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Evelyn Leeper
Post by Harry Mary Andruschak
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Only a wimpy 5.9? REAL Californians sleep on through 5.9s.
An exaggeration ... unless the 5.9 is happening a few hundred
miles away and most of the energy is absorbed by all the other
faults between you and it.
Post by Evelyn Leeper
Except, of course, that buildings in California are built to cope with
earthquakes, while most buildings in DC probably are not.
Just so. For one thing, the buildings we built once upon a time,
that weren't earthquake-resistant ... have all fallen down (or
been sufficiently damaged that they had to be torn down) in
*previous* earthquakes.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.
Dorothy J Heydt
2011-08-24 14:55:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Harry Mary Andruschak
Post by cryptoengineer
My office building here near Boston shook gently for a while around
1:54 pm. Apparently there was 5.9 quake down in VA.
I hope Keith and other rasf*rs in the area came through OK.
Only a wimpy 5.9? REAL Californians sleep on through 5.9s.
I have in my bookshelves the textbook from my geology class in, oh,
1960 or thereabouts. It was published in 1958. It still listed
"isostatic readjustment" as the cause of earthquakes (plate
tectonics were just about to burst onto the scene).

It contains a chart of the Rossi-Forel scale of earthquake
intensity, a precursor of the Modified Mercalli scale, measuring
earthquakes in tersm of the damage they do. It doesn't mention
the Richter scale *at all.*

Anyway, and here's why I hauled the book down: it says that of
course the Rossi-Forel scale is highly subjective. "For example,
the definition of the sixth degree of intensity included 'general
awakening of those asleep; general ringing of bells; oscillation
of chandeliers; stopping of clocks; some startled persons leaving
their dwellings.' *But an earthquake that produced those effects
in Italy or Switzerland might not even wake the baby in Japan, or
might cause a stampede in Boston."* (Emphasis added.)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.
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